by Alexandra Mansilla
To Make Music Inspired By RPGs. Interview With Nile, the Music Producer
29 Jul 2024
Guess what I almost said when we first met Nile? Yes, “Wassup, Nile?” I barely managed to stop myself. We ended up having a great conversation where Nile gradually transformed from a brutal guy into a hopeless romantic (you will see it at the end!).
So, what did we chat about? We covered how Nile became a music producer (not just a DJ), his time working at the airport, mental issues he had, and the creative process behind Groovy Brothers’ music. We also dug into the meaning behind some of his tracks and revealed the story behind the small scar on his cheek (spoiler: oh, it is an exciting tale).
— Nile, you are from Oman, right?
— Yes, I was born and raised in Oman. I actually had quite an eventful childhood. I grew up watching my dad play with DJ equipment and listening to 90s hip hop. I was exposed to the music of such artists as Dr. Dre and Tupac. As a kid, I didn’t understand exactly what they were saying, but I could remember the beats and how the instruments sounded in the songs. I would tell my dad, “Can you play that song that goes like this?” and then I would sound out the song for him. It wasn’t until later that I realised I had this in me since I was a kid.
— That is quite interesting because DJing has really evolved over the years. Nowadays, DJs can make quite good money and have a lot more opportunities. Was it more of a profession for your dad, or was it just a hobby for him?
— My dad worked two jobs. He worked for the Ministry of Defense during the day, going in the morning for his government job and coming back around 2 PM. He would take a nap, wake up at 6 PM, and then go DJ until about 3 AM. He did that five times a week, and on weekends, he would also DJ. Ironically, even though there weren't many DJs back then, my dad made a good living off of DJing. Now, there are so many DJs that they need to DJ a lot and build their brand to actually make a living from it, which many have managed to do.
Being exposed to my dad while he was DJing made me realise my love for music — not just DJing but also creating music from scratch, which is why I decided to go into producing. I do DJ here and there, especially if I feel like I can contribute artistically and showcase my love for music. I don’t DJ just to play; I want to show the world the music that I love. For example, I might find a song on SoundCloud with only 40 plays and share it with the crowd.
That is why I say I am a producer first — a producer who performs rather than just a DJ. It can be a bit tricky to explain. Not everyone understands producing unless they are really into music.
— So you were surrounded by music from a very young age. You once mentioned that you work with some nostalgic sounds. So, can you please tell me what music from your past can instantly bring up nostalgic feelings for you?
— I would say any Craig David song. Backstreet Boys and Blue. Michael Jackson, too. I am a huge Michael Jackson fan, and honestly, I think he s the greatest artist ever. Any Michael Jackson song just takes me back because my dad used to play his music all the time. It introduced me to raw artistic talent. He is legendary — no one, in my humble opinion, has ever come close to his greatness.
I remember when Michael Jackson passed away, my dad was a wreck for like a week. He would also play Michael Jackson concert DVDs, showing crowds fainting, crying, and literally passing out. As a kid, I didn’t understand why people were reacting like that, but later, I realised how deeply he resonated with so many people.
I remember whenever it was someone's birthday, my cousins and I would go to their house, and they would have those old-school music players with cassettes connected to big bulky speakers. They would play all these tracks like Backstreet Boys and Blue, and we would dance as kids. It is all recorded on VHS tapes. I remember hearing Dr. Dre, Tupac, and then Blue or Backstreet Boys would come on, and all the cousins would pretend we were in a boy band, doing the dances.
Recently, Kanye West sampled "Everybody" by Backstreet Boys, and as soon as I heard it, I lost my mind. Kanye is one of my top five favourite artists and one of the best producers alive. Hearing him sample that took me way back, but with a modern sound. It was surreal. Now, when I hear younger people jamming to it, I think, "You guys don't know where this came from.”
— Okay, it is all clear with your dad’s story. And what about your mom?
— My mom recently retired. She was a pharmacist and took care of me, my brother, and my sister while my dad was out working. She made sure we had everything we needed. When I was around 12 or 13, my parents separated and eventually got divorced, so for the second half of my childhood, I was essentially raised by a single mom. My mom always supported my interest in music, even though she initially saw it as a side hustle. But of course, like many parents, she had concerns about me going to college and getting a stable job. So, I got a scholarship to study engineering in the US.
My heart wasn't in engineering because I loved music and production. I discovered audio engineering, but I was scared of what my parents would think if I changed my major without telling them. I tried to stick with engineering but went through a lot of hard times mentally, emotionally, and spiritually.
Growing up, the only time I travelled was to Zanzibar when I was about eight or nine years old, and that was with a bunch of my cousins. After that, I hadn't been on a plane to any other country. So, moving to the US for college was a huge adjustment. You get out of high school, and suddenly, you have to be an adult. There is no manual for it — you just have to learn to be a grown man, go through hardships, and even though your family is there for you, you are alone.
— Could you please share what mental issues you experienced?
— Yes, sure, it was mainly a lot of very deep depression and anxiety. I had a lot of anxiety attacks, especially during my exams in college. I would have a final exam and get really strong anxiety attacks. Making music was my escape from all that. Staying out of trouble, I would just sit with my laptop, put on my headphones, and drift away for hours.
Unfortunately, things didn’t work out as I had hoped, so I dropped out of college in the US. I went back to Oman and found a job working at the new airport, which had just opened around that time.
— What did you do there?
— I actually worked for the airport in a separate building as a call centre agent. About six months into the job, I discovered a nearby college affiliated with Coventry University. They offered classes after work hours for people who wanted to continue their studies. With the power to make my own decisions, I decided to go back to college and finish my degree.
I worked four days on, four days off, with 12-hour shifts. If I clock in at 6 am, I would clock out at 4 pm, take a break, go to college, return at 8 pm, finish my shift, and get home around 10 pm. Sometimes, I would have a night shift, going to college at 4 pm, clocking in at 8 pm, and finishing at 8 am the next day. I did this for two years straight. The second year was when COVID-19 hit.
COVID-19 was a tough time for everyone, with lives and jobs lost. The global no-fly zone made it feel like a surreal fever dream. Ironically, COVID helped me complete my college diploma because everything shifted online. I could work from home and attend college online, making it easier and more economical since I wasn’t spending on gas. The little money I earned from the call centre went towards my tuition.
In my last semester of college, I had to make a significant choice. I could either take a job with a food delivery company, which offered a good salary and benefits as an account manager or leave that job and become a full-time student again. My mom was filing for retirement, and someone had to work to pay the bills. I chose to graduate prematurely with a higher education diploma and build a career while supporting my family.
I don’t regret that decision. It was one of the best I have ever made. While I believe everyone should strive for a bachelor’s degree, those were the cards I was dealt, and I played them well. I managed to build a good career and continue making music, which I love. I make music out of passion, not because I want to be a rockstar or famous.
If I can turn my love for music into a living, that would be the greatest blessing. I am a realist — I know bills need to be paid. But I believe I can do both: take care of my family and chase my dream. I don’t have to settle for one or the other.
— Now, Groovy Brothers. You are literally brothers, right?
— My younger brother is actually my best friend. Growing up, we fought a lot like most siblings, but I always felt bad afterwards. Our fights were just part of our strong bond. Despite our differences, we are very similar, and people often think we are twins, though I am four years older.
We both love music and video games. I started making beats, and one day, my brother surprised me by recording some of my tracks. He never told me when he realised he had talent, but he took it seriously. He learned how to songwrite, structure songs, and record properly. I would hear him practising his vocals in the bathroom, trying to hit the right notes. Each time, he came back better and better.
When it comes to making music, we rarely bump heads. We mostly see eye to eye and have a good level of compromise. Our main struggle is on the production side, ensuring the music sounds just right. Sometimes, I spend five minutes on a track; other times, it takes weeks or even months to perfect. But when I send it to him, and he says, "This is it," I know we have got it.
We have great chemistry when working together, and I am looking forward to what we will create next.
— I know you are inspired by music in video games. What music and video games have had a significant impact on you?
— RPGs have always been a huge part of my life. I love titles like the Final Fantasy series, which features a lot of classical instrumentals. Digimon was also a big one for me during my childhood. It was on the PS1 console, and I recently managed to download it on my phone. I have been playing it since last week, and it brings back so many memories.
Aside from Final Fantasy and Digimon, I also played a lot of God of War. There is another game called The Elder Scrolls, specifically Skyrim and Oblivion. These games take me back to my middle and high school years. I love those long, open-world games with lots of soundscaping and unique sounds. They offer an escape and let me forget about any stresses. I can sit and play with them for hours.
On the other hand, games like Call of Duty, which I sometimes play with my cousins and friends online, are too intense for me. I don't want my heart rate to skyrocket every time I play a video game. I prefer something calm and serene. Visually, I am really into the fantasy world with dragons and gnomes. Sorry, I am a bit nerdy!
— Do you use artificial intelligence while writing music?
— Yes, I use AI because I can't play instruments. I know notes and scales, but I am not proficient on the keyboard. I have a 49-key keyboard in front of me, and I have memorised some easy scales to play here and there. When I want to come up with chord progressions from scratch, I ask ChatGPT for options on a specific scale. I then experiment with these suggestions, moving notes around to see what works best.
AI is an excellent tool to help get the creative juices flowing, but I believe music and art must have a human element. Using AI to make a beat in a specific key and tempo doesn’t make you a producer; it is the human touch that counts. Even when putting in prompts, you need to know the right ones to get the desired results. So, I support using generative AI in creative ways, but it shouldn't replace the artist's input.
There are two types of producers: those who compose everything from scratch, starting from theory, and those who excel at drums but might lack in music theory. For me, I am focused on drums and can use other people's work for melodies. That is how hip-hop started, with sampling pieces of records and adding drums to create something new. Some people say if you don't make your melodies from scratch, you are not a real producer, but I don’t agree with that.
I do create some stuff from scratch, but my samples often turn out better. I have learned a lot from working with producers like AY, who produces most of Moh Flow’s stuff, and Mind Circus. They taught me how to make melodies, and during COVID, we started pushing out sample packs on Hrmny + Lab. I am forever grateful to AY because that collaboration helped me pay my college tuition.
— I saw an amazing work for Beirut in August 2020 on Instagram. Can you tell me more about that project?
— So, that was also an initiative by AY. He decided we should put out a sample pack where we wouldn’t take any of the proceeds, and all the earnings would be donated to charity. It was great to see producers come together for this cause.
Usually, it is just me, AY, and Mind Circus working on sample packs. But this time, we had more than 10 producers contributing. Each producer provided one or two samples or loops, including drums, melodies, and various sounds. The files were all solo, so any artist could use them royalty-free after purchasing the pack. If I remember correctly, the price wasn't fixed; customers could choose the amount to donate. It was a fantastic initiative, and it felt great to see the community come together for a good cause.
— Okay, got it. Also, in 2021, you posted two works — "Call Me" and "Juice." You captioned "Call Me" as "something very special". Why?
— I composed “Call Me” for my then-girlfriend, now wife. I was really pouring my emotions into that record. I imagined myself writing a song and thinking about the type of beat I would compose, and that was the one.
— And what about “Juice”? You wrote: “This one is different. It is not in the store cause your fav artist is probably already on this. I won’t say more.”
— I was supposed to get that track to a huge artist in the community. He is an international artist, not massively famous, but he is a significant name in the producer community. When it comes to placements, you never announce anything prematurely. For example, if I had a song with Drake, J. Cole, or Lil Baby, and their manager tells me it is going to be on the album, I wouldn’t celebrate until I see my song on the album once it drops. Songs can get bumped off at the last minute. Sometimes, songs get placed years after you send them, or they might come out almost immediately.
So, even though I was excited, I didn’t want to jinx it by saying anything. I sent the track, but I never heard back. It is probably never happening, but if it does, I will find out when the song is released. This is common for producers to avoid leaks and to respect the artist's plans. Unless you are part of the artist’s close circle and have insider knowledge, you won’t know for sure if your track will make it onto the album. Artists scrap songs all the time for various reasons, which is why there are so many leaks and unreleased tracks. As a producer, you don’t celebrate until the song is officially out.
— And what music do you listen to when no one sees you?
— I bump Rihanna's album "Anti" a lot. I think that album is a classic; the production is phenomenal. It is one of those albums I listen to alone. I love R&B, especially the kind that is more about hopeless romance than the newer, more toxic stuff.
You know, the kind where the artist is begging for their girl back in the rain. R&B artists don’t sit in bathtubs crying anymore like they did in the 2000s.
Thank you, Bobby Valentino! Remember that song where he was in the shower all dressed up? And Mario, with his song "I Don’t Wanna Know" — I sing that out loud. Recently, Metro Boomin did a version with The Weeknd, but I still feel like the original hits harder. I am trying to think of the exact song, but those are the vibes I am talking about.
— Okay, and if you don't mind me asking, I noticed a small scar on your cheek. What is the story behind it?
— So when I was a baby, a friend of my mom’s came over with her baby, and apparently, that baby bit me really hard, leaving a mark. It was a baby’s bite, and it never went away. I don’t remember how old I was, but the mark stayed.
— I thought there would be another story!
— No, you know, everyone expects some cool warrior story. But no, I was just a poor baby who got bullied by another baby.
— Which projects are you involved in now?
— I am working on a lot of songs with Groovy Bros. We are aiming to release a song every month or two, still figuring out the frequency. I am also trying to bring back Hrmny + Lab with AY, but life's busy for both of us. Managing another business alongside a day job is challenging, so sometimes personal projects get delayed due to exhaustion.
— Again, about nostalgic sounds. And in your interview with Not an Agency, you mentioned focusing on nostalgic sounds, especially from childhood cartoons. Which cartoons are you referring to exactly?
— There is a specific channel called Spacetoon that dubbed anime in Arabic, even the opening songs, creating a unique identity for these shows in the Arab world. This initiative made Japanese cartoons more digestible and relatable. My next project is going to be be heavily influenced by that, I cannot wait to show everybody.
— Do you want to create music for cartoons or video games?
— Oh, I would love to make some music for video games. Definitely, Santa Monica Studios, if you are ever looking, hit me up! I would love to compose for Final Fantasy, too.
Back in 2018, I did a composition and voiceover for a telecom company in Oman. They gave me a video and wanted background sounds for different scenes — like ocean effects for ocean scenes and cinematic strings. They also provided a script for the voiceover, which I did. Even though I cringe a little when I think about it, it was a great experience and the video got over 200,000 views.
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